There are so many communities within the "gay"community...even those designed for gay black men and women... those who are in different socio-economic states... those in different political associations. Most find their own community with those who can identify with them... and that does not always means it's going to be with gay people.


< I am sure this will be called an "attack" and GOD (druben) will remove it and me.

Reading what you said of others in this room MAD JACK, I am sure you feel the same. I just say mine shit where people know upfront.

I am in no way saying that all whites are the same. But if the racist shoe fits, wear it.

__________

I'm so tired of this attack shit or people watching what they say. To be clear : If you private message me and tell me to watch my back.... You'll kill me. Thats an attack.

so, if "being gay is a VERY VERY VERY VERY small part" of who you are, then uhh . . . why be in an alternative gay people tribe? cause if it's VERY (x4) small, then it's probably just so small you completely forget about it. like "Hey baby, nice fuckin' ti--oh wait, I'm gay. Gosh, I keep forgetting, it's just so VERY VERY VERY VERY small."

Mad Jack? Someone threatened to kill you? I would report that to Tribe help asap and they would probably cancel that persons membership. Thats rediculous!

I'm not real into the "gay community" myself. However, I don't see it as more separatist & racist than the rest of society. I have see that within the gay community for sure but I tend to think the gay community overall is more sensitive and mindful of such things. Simply by virtue of our own place in the world. There are definitely some negative aspects of the gay world that I dont care for. But I'm not gonna discount all the good things which I see because of some bad things. I don't go out much anymore because I did it for so long and would rather save money or do other things. I will still go out once in a while & I enjoy it still though. But there is a whole world full of gay people out there that have nothing to do with typical gay lifestyle. Clubs are a good place to hang out and dance & have fun. So is Golds Gym though. lol So are house parties & dinners with friends & day trips, etc.... There are so many things we can occupy our time with. My sexuality or "gayness" has shown me how it is totally possible to live my life as I please. That I am free to live as I choose. That my life is not ruled by what other people think. Even if I was str8 I wouldnt want to live for anyone but myself. But being gay has helped me understand & see the world in so many different ways. I don't think you have to be gay to see those same things by no means but I do think being gay has played a big part in how I view the world. I'm a white guy so no I don't know what it's like to be someone else whether they are another white person, black, Chinese, Japanese, Mexican, Korean, etc........ I'm well aware of how people treat other people badly for various reasons, including race. BUT, I, as a gay man, and any of us, as whatever we are, should not succumb to a victim mentality just because the world is full of assholes. This is what being gay has taught me. That no matter if we are gay or what is the color of our skin, we should keep our chins up and be proud of ourselves. That we should not give any power to the irrelevant negativity that anyone else is wasting their time with. The possibilities for us as people to create our own reality and make the most of our lives AND enjoy them are infinite. We do NOT have to be weighted down by limited tunnel vision thinking & inhibition.

Cheers!

Boost! This thread shalt not be ignored! ;P

Scott that is the biggest crock of shit.
As one of those guy who say "being gay plays a very small role in my life", I can assure you that my interests and personality do not stem from me "wanting to fit in with straight people". My interests and personality is a result of growing up in a small town and hanging around with my brother and his friends (who were all metalheads). I grew up to love the music and love the lifestyle of drag cars, dirtbikes, heavy metal etc etc. I don't find anything interesting in stereotypical gay life. That's not to say it's BAD, it's just that I personally don't find it interesting, so why the hell would I wrap myself up in it? Would you wrap yourself up in something that you weren't at all interested in?
What pisses me off is those homosexual men who stand up and shout "BE YOURSELF" but the minute someone actually IS being THEMSELVES they claim that they are not because they don't fit the cookie-cutter stereotype of homosexuality or they'll claim the stereotypical "you just want to 'act' straight". So we can't win either way. I shouldn't be judged just because I naturally have more in common with a lot of heterosexual men than homosexual ones. That's so rude dude. Seriously.
I have ALWAYS been EXTREMELY comfortable with my sexuality, so much in fact that it has never been an issue and I have never felt the need to wear it on my sleeve.
The times I have gone into a gay bar with friends (and believe me that was the ONLY reason as i usually try to drag them to my metal gigs) I was met with comments like yours OR people assuming that I'm there to start trouble and/or gay bash someone.
If I had a dollar for everytime a gay man shouted at me "you try to hard to be straight" or "why the fuck are you here, don't you know we're GAY". I'd be a fucking milionaire.
Apparently it's okay to accept difference in the gay 'community' as long as that 'difference' is the same as everyone else and you fit their mould.
I've noticed that "difference" and "alternative" to a lot of homosexual men is listening to 'indi-bands' or shaving your head into a mohawk. But the SECOND a gay man crosses that "alterna-line" and fits what we woud call the "stereotypical heterosexual traits", they are suddenly judged, blasted, made fun of or called down. When THAT line is crossed, that's when you hear shit like "you're trying to be straight".
What's even funnier is that is so transparent that the people who say this are very obviously threatened by homosexual masculinity in it's TRUE sense and terrified of those who go against the grain of what we're continually TOLD we "should be".
Practise what you preach.
If some gay men want to shout it from the rooftops and are 'proud' to be queer, that's totally cool with me, I don't care. I sure wish though that the same could be said in regards to me and people like me on the OTHER SIDE. I would like for once for a gay man to accept me and MY LIFE as being JUST THAT....me and MY LIFE, without thinking or judgeing that I have some sort of "straight agenda" by simply being myself.
You have no right to judge me (or anyone else) based upon my decision to not make "being gay" a large part of life.
Saying that the few of us who don't make "gay" a big deal in our lives are "play-acting to try to fit in with straight people" is extremely ignorant and you should be ashamed of yourself for claiming that; not only as a gay man but a human being in general.

As a newbie in the tribe, this seems like a good topic with which to jump into the fray.

I'm going to depart from some of the previous posts by saying that being Queer is a major part of my identity. While I – and some of my friends -- don't see me as one-dimensional, being Queer informs how I interact with the world. It is the context from which I negotiate much of my daily life. And it is a significant determinant in what I see as possible.

Since none of you know me (yet), I'll fill in some background. Fifty eight trips around the sun means that sexual beginnings for me -- which started late in life -- occurred during the early 1970's.

Stonewall happened less than a hundred miles from where I lived in Connecticut but, I didn't hear word one about it. Any mention of homosexuality -- use of the word gay was not part of the lexicon then – was a strict taboo. There was no history, mythology, sense of tribe, or peers to inform me as to just what being Queer meant. A friend invited me to go to Woodstock, but I foolishly told him that I had to work. So I missed one of the defining events that shaped a generation.

Sexuality was just one more source of confusion for me as I negotiated life. I was cloistered away in an orphanage during my early childhood. And I was thrown out of my home at sixteen (not for being gay, I didn't know what that meant then) but because I was the child of an absent father and a hostile mother. To say that I was clueless, would be a major understatement. I knew virtually nothing about how to interact with other people. And how to negotiate society at large was completely confusing to me.

I entered service in the ARMY during the Viet Nam war. I was about to be drafted. I was fortunate that I had not developed my sexual identity during that time. Life in the military was easier by not contending with sexual issues. One of my first hints about my being Queer happened when I notice another GI in the barracks laying in bed one night with the blanket pulled just up to the bottom of his bare pectorals. I didn't comprehend why this scene stirred a response in me. I just thought it was a pleasant experience.

It may be hard to relate to the notion that someone in their twenties could be so out of touch. A few years after I was discharged from the ARMY my hormones kicked in. I met a hippy artist that was selling his paintings on the street in Georgetown in Washington, D.C. That was the beginning of a wonderful, long friendship. He was instrumental in my development as a Gay person and as a member of the human race. I held his hand when he died of AIDS in 1995.

When I first encountered 'Gay Culture', the one thing that struck me was that no one else had history, mythology, or tribe to draw on and we were all just 'winging it.' The gay stereotype consisted of the flaming, bitchy queen. And many of my initial encounters with Gay folk were with people that affected this stereotype.

Since I had been inculcated with the mores of straight society, I did not accept effeminate males as friends. Eventually, I came to accept that some people are naturally effeminate, others are masculine and I accepted both if it seemed they were presenting their real self and not some expected, affective mask.

I recently moved to Northern California to connect with Gay and Buddhist communities here. Ironically, I have connected with neither. Health issues keep me either at home, or in the hospital most of the time these days.

Most of my friends in Southwest Virginia are straight and much younger than me. They are musicians. I recorded bands and did live sound for local gigs. They are all married with young children – all of whom, I adore. I made no effort to hide my sexuality with these musician friends and they accept me as I am. They see me as a regular guy that just happens to prefer having sex with males, instead of females. Part of why I moved west was to try to initiate deeper, multi-dimensional friendships that go beyond the limited way I relate to my straight friends.

As to why being Queer informs my life.... I saw the possibilities for relationships in a Gay context. I wanted to re-invent the way I live without arbitrarily accepting the culture of Babylon. Do I relate to the Gay community as I perceive it exists today? Not much. But, a Gay paradigm is the basis from which I would like to explore new possibilities of living. Gay is what I am.